At the SPAA Conference last week, Packed to the Rafters‘ creator Bevan Lee addressed a long-running question about Australian drama genres.
He acknowleged the success of US dramas such as True Blood, but says such high-concept shows most likely couldn’t succeed here.
“Vampires in a country town in Australia is equally valid but … [the audience] would say, ‘What a lot of nonsense – vampires in Australia?’ he said.
“It would be laughed off screen.”
Likewise fantasy or science-fiction doesn’t work locally, he says.
“They go ‘if you’re going to come all the way across the universe to invade, are you really going to bother with Australia?’” Lee said.
“That’s America not us.”
Lee says Rafters is a drama about a family, rather than being a family drama. This year there was a bit of lesson-learning about audience reactions. He doesn’t regret including recent masturbation scenes, so much as the moral outrage from some viewers.
“I thought the reaction was absolutely stupid. I thought ‘what are these people doing? Do they live in the world that I live?’” he asked.
“It scared me slightly because I just felt if they really want this thing to be just a set of blinkers, I just don’t think I wanted to do it.”
Seven got a double lesson in viewer outrage this year with Home & Away‘s ‘gay kiss’ attracting headlines too. As a network drama exec, Lee had to deal first hand with both issues.
Meanwhile, Producer Jo Porter believes Australians only want to see “middle Australia.”
“I think it’s a case of tall poppy syndrome as well,” she said.
“Can you imagine a successful show where it’s a wealthy family in Australia? Australians like to see middle Australia.”
No wonder Taurus Rising never lasted….
Source: ABC, news.com.au
As sad as it is, we as a whole are even more dumbed down than our American counterparts. Australians as viewers prefer simple, predictible and single minded shows. This is country where a show as highy awared and critically acclaimed as “Lost” is, can garner under 300 thousand viewers for its Emmy nominated season finale. Yet over 3 and a half million people chose to watch two women cook dinner, its simply a sad state of affairs.
“Two and a Half Men”, “Rules of Engagement” and “The Big Bang Theory” are what is popular in comedy here in Oz, even though they are run of the mill, lowest common denomintaor shows. Yet programs like “The Office”,” Arrested Development” and “30 Rock” are not watched by the public, or even given a chance by the networks. And why? Well one reason is because there is no ‘Laugh Track’, aussie viewers rely on this to tell them when the jokes happen.
Australians would much rather watch talentless people present clip shows, than try to actually broaden their horizons and use some intellect and watch an intricate and wonderfully written, acted and produced show like “Lost”. It is indeed, a sad state of affairs…
Want new, funny, smart, edgy, well-written Australian television dramatic comedy you’ve never seen before? I ROCK premieres on ABC2 in early 2010 (8 x 1/2 hour episodes). Watch out for it – it’s going to be good.
As a population are we really so vacuous? Australians prefer middle-Australia? How sad.
Still, I shouldn’t be surprised. Quality science-fiction programming has time and again been relegated to the late night slots to be replaced with more CSI and Law and Order than you can poke a stick at, along with ahem…”middle-Australia” programs.
I think it’s time to go and leave middle-Australia to the rest of the population…
Packed to the Rafters,never heard of it.The operative word here to why they make
this type of Ho-hum shows is ‘Cheap’
That’s why I don’t watch local drama. Suburbia bores me in real life, why would I want to see more of it on TV? And it’s not the shortage of creative talent — I know a lot of writers, and I know this country has a lot of imaginative people.
I understand that there are huge financial risks involved in making SF and fantasy shows but it’s just sad that if it weren’t for Americans and Brits, I wouldn’t be watching TV.
i’m moving to america just so i can watch tv show right when they screen for the first time and not have to put up with the aussie sadness i see on free to air tv, foxtel is deleying the journey a little bit though
Tangle is an exception. Tangle is brilliant
Some very harsh comments here. Surprised that some are criticising artists who have made their way and forged success with such venom. Fair enough if Rafters isn’t your cuppa. Hopefully the debate inspires some to take up a pen and write the television they actually want to see. There is a lot of other drama that seems to have been overlooked. Saved, Tangle, East West 101, The Circuit, Bed of Roses, Wilfred etc. Not sci fi perhaps, but it’s not all about Rafters and Sea Patrol.
Wow I bet Bevan’s audience was inspired by his daring, forward thinking and groundbreaking vision for Australian television. His quest for mediocrity is a shining example for the industry.
the country is full of philistines, it cares about winning more gold medals, rather than thinking too much outside their peanut brains
What about an x-files/torchwood style sci-fi show set in a recently closed down US/Aust military installation in the dead centre. A new story every week as well as an ongoing sub-plot about the military installation. You could even adapt Mad Max to a TV series.
The Aussie entertainment industry has no balls! They are also the reason for the most part I dont watch Aussie TV, its so bland (apart from the rare show like The Hollowmen)
As for Sci Fi, Farscape failed here because CH9 never gave it a chance. Traditionaly they put Sci fi on late, thus never giving the public the chance to see it. Australia can make great sci fi, from the 1970′s series Andra to Farscape, it top shelf!
The fact that Bevan Lee and Jo Porter can’t imagine events happening here in Australia tells me that they have no imagination to begin with.
I think he is wrong. Surely we can create a high concept australian show or if not sci-fi/fantasy then what about a good drama like The Wire.
I think it’s more of an economic issue when it comes to Australian dramas. I also believe it’s unfair to say an Australian high concept show wouldn’t work here when they’ve never tried one. With a reasonable budget and a good cast and crew i believe a show like True Blood could work here, but the networks are so unwilling to give it a chance. So we’re stuck with factuals, reality trash & cop shows along with stupid American sitcoms and crime/medical procedurals
It’s an issue of population, not taste or culture. Australia just doesn’t have a population big enough to support niche shows.
When was the last time we saw a wealthy family on Australia TV? Like the 40 week model, they’re so quick to write it off despite the fact that no one has even tried anything like it lately.
Good lord if the industry is taking it’s cues from Bevan Lee it really is game over – talk about a resume filled with (Channel Seven approved) mediocrity.
You can take your family dramas and shove it – I’ll be watching some American TV thanks!
I understand,
no talent in Australia, i get it.
Aus versions of genre shows like CSI, Nip/Tuck, The Shield (about corrupt cops), Dexter, Sex and the City, Supernatural, Buffy, Gossip Girl, Vampire Diaries, True Blood, X-Files, Californication (and an Aus version of no budget, overhyped crap films like Blair Witch Project and Paranormal Activity) could be done, but it’s correct Australia is hampered by a small population, lack of funds, bad writing and bad writers, plus Aus free to air networks unwilling to take a risk, while the advertising market is recessed.
On any such project, a free to air Aus network would probably need to partner up with either Foxtel and/or a UK network (or all 3), where a combo of Aus and some UK actors are in the cast.
The Daybreakers vampire film (that was filmed almost 3 years ago in Brisbane and the Gold Coast and is coming out in a couple months) was done mostly with US money.
Scifi is trickier. Farscape was US funded and used mostly Aus actors, but always struggled to find viewers on Nine (it would’ve fared much better if GO existed 9 years ago). Scifi is very expensive with sets, costumes, FX and the Aus accent doesn’t travel overseas. An Aus scifi show would need to be done as an Aus, UK, US co-production, or preferably between all 3.
Even UK shows like the current Dr. Who and Torchwood only have minimal popularity in the US. Batt Galactica (and now the Caprica prequel series) was done as a US – UK co-production and had some UK actors. One (James Callis) spoke in his own accent, while another (Jamie Bamber) spoke in a US accent in it.
Absolute mediocrity. Aussies may watch it but they will never sell it over sees much beyond Britain. True blood will sell everywhere and on DVD too.
Strange how many Aussies play important role overseas even heading drama series yet there is a real lack of true drama here.
Sorry, David, but I don’t understand the producers’ logic regarding fantasy and sci-fi programs. Why does have to everything need to happened in Australia? When using those genres it can happen anywhere. How many of those programs have been produced for kids in Australia. Have a look, quite a few. I think the problem is that some people thing that fantasy and sci-fi are too “childish” to be taken seriously? The only reason I think is why those shows are not made here for adults is because of much higher production costs, especially if they involve CGI, which some of those programs would definitely require. Doctor Who is a perfect example.
Sci-fi and fantasy are niche genres and we simply don’t have the population to get enough eyes on screens for them. We can lament the lack of local sci-fi, but even the high profile US stuff like Heroes and Lost didn’t rate well enough to stay on main channels after the novelty factor wore off.
That said, the networks are very narrow with what they do produce, and making another family, cop or hospital drama with “all new extra quirkiness!” is not really pushing the boundries at all. If it’s going to happen it will have to be on Foxtel – if a network had made Satisfaction, for instance, it no doubt would have ended up a campy Chances-style mess.
At the end of the day, though, local content is successful when it is a reflection (even if it usually is suspiciously middle class and Anglo-Celtic) of the population at large, and when there are so many imported vampire and alien shows on offer it is probably important that the few local dramas made supply that. Which is why we have local content rules in the first place.
Thats the way – whatever you do dont take a risk. Great philosophy that has worked so well for ch9 as well.
Australians just don’t like science fiction full stop. On the whole, the Australian viewing public are extremely small minded. They want nice, clean, neatly packaged storylines about people they can relate to. The moment a show becomes too out-there or complicated, they switch off in droves. Just look at what happened with Lost. In the US it’s ratings may have slipped, but it’s still a prime time show, whereas here it’s been relegated to late night slots (yes that’s right, our society is even dumber than the US).
Packed to the Rafters is a good drama, but it is admittedly very safe. Then again this is why it rates so well and to such a broad audience. An Anglo family drama with a light tone and narration to walk even the stupidest of people through the characters’ emotions. I’m not bagging the show (I love it!) but look at the ratings – this is what people want. Then again have the networks ever tried something else? The lack of Aussie shows that venture outside the crime/family/medical/legal genre is still very disappointing. On that note, can’t wait for Spirited (on DVD of course – no Pay TV here!)
Could Australia produce cutting edge sci-fi TV? Well it has in the awesome show that was Farscape. Yep the money and the lead guy were American. but the directors/music/effects/cast …mostly aussies filmed in Sydney. Shame it has not been properly screened here as it became space opera at it’s finest.
The film District 9 proves it doesn’t matter where the aliens land as long as the writing is good, in every invasion film of recent years there is almost always the shot of UFOs over Sydney Harbour. Like others have said these 7 network comments are just a cop-out to not take any risks. I don’t remember seeing any localy made sci-fi shows in the last 20 years other than US or UK paid productions so how do they know it wouldn’t work?
The article says “taste of viewer outrage about a gay kiss” and then talks about newspaper headlines. But the newspaper headlines came First, before and so called “viewer outrage”.
The newspaper headlines caused the non existent viewer outrage.
Without the newspaper headlines it would have been a non event. No one cares.
Which means in Australia newspapers can determine and dictate to television what they can show. And every time some newspaper with nothing better to do creates such a fuss the TV people go running for cover like good children.
Australian TV is so conservative because they are cowered by the newspapers. And newspapers are pitched at very conservative old people. Viewers don’t care about most of the things TV shows are scared about showing. TV is scared about the newspapers…not the viewers. They need to get a backbone and follow the ratings and get with the times.
That’s why young people are deserting old fashioned Australian TV shows.
David, your comment at 11.22 ” Would we buy The 4400 landing in Dubbo? Doubtful” is the mindset which is part of the problem. It is basically saying we can’t do the same so we won’t do anything remotely similar to it. Of course we wouldn’t buy it. It was written in US by US for US. Why do Aussies persist is saying ‘we can’t do what they do because it won’t work’? Don’t do what they do! They have the money to do big scale. Don’t try to compete.
Culture informs the writing.
Take America’s gun culture, as an extreme example. Australia can’t imitate many US shows simply because of this difference between us. How well could we do a resist an invasion show when most the population don’t have guns? To arm everyone would feel wrong.
The reverse is also true. There are hit Aussie shows that won’t necessarily work overseas.
It is so odd when you consider the fabulous, quirky and unique children’s genre shows Australia produces and sells overseas that we can’t produce adult ones. As many of the comments here point out, good writing with interesting characters will win out when given the chance.
If they spent more money developing (esp. writing and rewriting) shows that are different they might get somewhere.
The comparison with the US is a moot point. They have a TV market over 10 times the size of ours. Plus, acclaimed shows such as True Blood, Sopranos, etc, are all made on pay TV networks over there like HBO – a subscription service. In a way, there is a mini-version of that here, with shows like Love My Way appearing on pay TV and not on FTA, but the bottom line here for commercials is advertising revenue and that is why they are risk-averse. Having said that. I agree that it sucks and wonder if there is some way the system can change in the FTA landscape, so that advertising dollars don’t dictate the sort of shows made all the time.
We can’t make decent comedies either for that matter, useless writers and el cheapo production. They can’t move on from crap like Hey Dad
Science fiction in Australia has never seemed to work unfortunately. Even when the major networks have bothered to screen an American sci fi show in prime-time, the audience has been minimal.
Even if the local industry did produce a sci-fi show – which they did several years ago with Farscape – it would have a lot of comedic elements in it rather than being a totally serious drama.
Bevan Lee is quite right in his comments – I remember him getting a lot of stick back in the 80′s for the more outlandish plotlines he wrote for Sons and Daughters, which – although I still love the show – I doubt would work in the rather staid TV landscape of today.
Interesting that Russell speaks of “Always Greener” in a way that suggests the creators should hang their head in some way for creating it. Given that it was cancelled when rating around 1.3 million and the fact it is one of the very few Aussie dramas to crack an International Emmy nomination for best drama, I doubt they’d agree with him “Headland” is probably a different kettle of fish, but that was no worse nor better to be honest than shows with similar ambitions like “Home and Away” or “Neighbours”. Also, I would comment to Russell that if he’d watched much of “Always Greener” he’d realise it was one of the quirkiest, most original series there’s ever been on commercial television. It had a simple premise, but it was very original and groundbreaking in a lot of its execution. “Rafters”, “Greener” and “Headland” do share common themes of family and relationship, but to lump the three together as the same sort of family soap suggests Russell has perhaps viewed a lot less of them than I. They’re very different shows and both “Rafters” and “Greener”, despite their domestic themes, are very original creations.
It is just another sign, that Australian content requirements should be completely scrapped. I’m so tried of the generic Australian TV series (ie cops, family drama, medical, soapie), with very few imaginative series around. And I have never seen an Australian movie, that I actually enjoyed either.
One of my favorite science fiction series is Farscape, which was produced in Australia. Although the series got terrible treatment by Nine, and even poor DVD releases in Australia.
there are talent in australia but the scripts and characters they played let them down. thats why when aussie actors go overseas, their so successful becasue they play characters that are so well develpoed it let them show off their talent. and its so stupid to say that aussie tv is playing safe, i wouldnt mind a werewolf tv series or some other sorts. also about people getting offended and stuff, when did aussies become so precious?
There’s a lot of truth in a lot of comments here, but I also think Bevan Lee has made some good points.
Would we buy The 4400 landing in Dubbo? Doubtful. But we would if it kept its tongue in its cheek. SBS aired Undead two weeks ago with zombies in Qld. Film diverts from the argument somewhat, but even that one had an intrinsically Aussie flavour to it because it was a low budget indie flick. I suspect a series like Dead Set could be made well here too. A single alien as a fish out of water with an Aussie family (a la Mork) might have some sitcom value. And Claudia Karvan is already at work on her ghostly Spirited.
That said, I agree any V / X Files / Twilight clones bring risks that probably outweight logic.
I’m not sure I like his huge presumptuousness of knowing what everybody wants and how everybody thinks.
It’s true we don’t have the budgets for a huge series overflowing with visual effects. But high concepts can still work. We do have writing talent here that can make it work, if they’re ever given a chance.
And while they’re at it, can we have less relationship drama in our police shows, please? And maybe some humour thrown in to replace it? Because I really don’t care about who is sleeping with whom, especially in the midst of a high adrenaline rescue.
Producers like Bevan Lee and Jo Porter are exactly the ones we have to blame for the lack of creativity in Australian drama. They are the people holding the whole industry back. Sure they have “packed to the Rafters” as a hit now. But they were also responsible for “Headland” and “Always Greener”. They basically keep creating the same show over and over, while getting up at conferences and proclaiming Australians would not embrace any other kind of genre.
They are the ones who have created this very attitude, and keep it alive by making such statements as these, and then going about creating the same family soap operas over and over.
There are plenty of ideas that are not vampires or wealthy families that would be suited to Australian sensibilities.
What about two quirky cops who solve crimes based on visions in the Top end?
What about a family that lives in the mountains of Tasmania, in a haunted house.
What about a Mum from the suburbs who looks after her loving family and raises her kids, but hides her dark secret that she is a killer. Or a prostitute. Or a government spy. What about a half hour comedy about a yuppy Melbourne family from Toorak who is forced to move to outback Queensland to take a job with a mining company.
I mean, I am not a producer. I am throwing silly ideas out here. But what I am saying is, the reason we don’t have these types of shows is not because Australians will not embrace them, it’s because networks and producers like Bevan and Jo are afraid of trying new things, that they would have to work hard at to get right, for fear of failure. They would rather do the same formula, that is easy, and they know they are good at.
And as long as they then get up there and say that this is the way it has to be….things will never change.
Fair dinkum……………………….. how shallow, how insulting, are they saying those things because they have no new ideas.
I think it has more to do with our writing, production and quality in acting in order to pull it off. We have some good actors but the writing really lets them down on most occasions. Plus I don’t know what it is with Aussie film makers, they force the actors to put on this fake Aussie accent. Most Australians speak pretty normal and very few like Kath and Kim, with Julia Gillard the exemption.
Any subject matter, vampires, aliens, werewolves, ghosts, invisible men, witches, genies etc. if well written would be accepted by the viewing public. Australians want to be entertained and if you watch science fiction or any spooky stuff you don’t over analyze it because it ruins the fun. I’m sure that the people who loved Buffy didn’t lose sleep thinking about why in all the places in the world it could be the Hellsgate ended up in Sunnydale. Bevan Lee needs to be aware of the world everyone else lives in and not assume that we all want to live in his world where he thinks masturbation is entertainment.
Well duh. Packed to the Rafters is quite possibly the most disgustingly “safe” crowd pleasing non-reality show on Aussie TV. The volume of sentimentality in the first few episodes alone was especially appalling, particularly since the audience wouldn’t have known the characters long enough to really care.
Really, what is the basis for this really ignorant person’s claim that a vampire show wouldn’t work with an Australian cast/context? Maybe if somebody had the balls to try, rather than hashing out one derivative cop/medical show after with only menial differences to distinguish them from one another. Really, I’ve laughed off City Homicide after the first episode as it cast the likes of Daniel MacPherson, Shane Bourne and Noni Hazlehurst; none of whom I can take seriously in law enforcement/authoritarian roles, however I’d sooner believe any of them as pixies, centaurs or blood suckers.
My, my. We’re simply spoiled for choice in this country. Medical procedurals, cop shows galore, and a single primetime family drama which is an embarrassment to watch.
If you respect your audience enough to give them a well written show that isn’t grossly conventional, maybe, just *maybe* people will watch. -.-
But why is fantasy and SciFi not popular over here, when we all stream to it when it does come over here, like twilight for example. Vampire Diaries, True Blood australia is on the band wagon and the best we might get is some tacky script writer that introduces the summer bay vampire.
Everything we do on tv seems to revolve around that soap show, if it has not been to summer bay it wont work sort of attitude from the networks.
Step out on a limb, make a show we know we can, then get the world hooked.
Middle as in commecial networks. Thankfully SBS and ABC still take risks.
What a poor excuse for not making shows other than predictable cop shows or a show about a boring family, how do they know fantasy shows wont work when they wont make them and stick to the same dull ideas.
The comment about sci-fi is so much bollocks and really only highlights the primary problem in the industry… A complete lack of imagination and originality.
You could easily write fantasy and sci-fi that blended into the Australian landscape, look at movies like Mad Max. Have this guy ever travelled around our nation? There are plenty of little towns that give the impression they’re populated by aliens!
No ambition got it.
True. Any show about niche topics such as vampires will only ever attract a cult audience which, in Australia, is such a small number that it’s not really worth the commercial networks investment. Whereas a cult audience is the US is still a couple million or more. Shame as it’s not good for diversity. ABC is really the only one that can attempt these kinds of shows as they’re not as ratings driven.
Bevan Lee’s comments that people would not accept vampires in an Australian country town is one thing, but why dismiss the possibility of any science fiction?
If a live action series was created with no human (or even vaguely humanoid) characters ina nonEarth setting then the credulity gap should not be an issue.
Whilst Mr Lee makes the point that drama should be pitched to the middle ground that does mean that there are many groups out there who feel disconnected from drama production and utterly disinterested in their output.
Science fiction is popular and more importantly it sells. A well made and interesting science fiction drama from this country, told in a sober fashion without intentional or unintentional humour is the kind of thing that would sell well on DVD internationally and would generate sales into the American and other markets.
Is Packed to the Rafters being seen anywhere else ebyond the confines of our drought-ridden isle?
Since when are vampires from another Universe?
This is sad but true. But it’s up to the drama creators to use their imagniation. How about a show where aliens arrive in outback Australia, because they got Australia and America mixed up? They saw a Maccas in Dubbo and said “we’re here!”. Then play the Australian characters up against them? Comedy gold.
Unbelievable though he called his audience stupid…
I don’t think they’re trying hard enough.
Bevan, much, much respect for ignoring the tabloid trash non-controversy. The people that tried to make that storyline an issue are, ironically, wankers.
Let’s face it, Australia couldn’t make most of the shows America makes. Money and writing talent (or lack of either) has a lot to do with it. Less that 5% of what I watch is Australian made.
If they are talking alien invasion why can’t it be that the whole world is being invaded but this show just focuses on the viewpoint of australians and takes place in australia, it is happening in america too, just that we don’t see it. That excuse is a cheap cop-out. And there is more to sci-fi than just alien invasions or vampires, try using some creativity and originality, it doesn’t even have to be sci-fi, just something different, something we haven’t seen before. Beastmaster was australian and quite good, it is the only show I want to add to my dvd collection that I haven’t been able to so far due to a lack of availability.